Anybody know if the Vitara DDiS models have DPF equipped?

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Anybody know if the Vitara DDiS models have DPF equipped? Empty Anybody know if the Vitara DDiS models have DPF equipped?

Post by Spruce on Mon Jan 18, 2016 1:05 pm

Came up on a thread at suzuki-forums (not allowed to post since newbie) and then even more articles on DPF issues. It's some sort of filter fitted on diesels to make them more 'green' but also one that requires lots of highway driving in order to clean itself out. Needless to say, harmful to the car when constantly city driving or if going off-road.

Given that Suzuki had some Grand Vitara owners taking them to court over it, I'd figure it's no longer the case, but curious if anybody here knows for sure.

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Post by theforestdweller on Mon Jan 18, 2016 1:35 pm

DPFs can be a problem if owners are not aware of how to keep them healthy. Some dealerships are also to blame for selling diesel vehicles to owners without checking how they use their vehicles or explaining the DPF requirements.

"lots of highway driving" is not a requirement. It is the case that occasional, once week or so, higher engine speed driving, ie 2000+rpm for around 20 minutes will enable the DPF to regenerate.

I've owned DPF equipped RAV4, CRV, Freetrack, Qashqai, iX35 and Mokka. Only the Qashqai once complained with a DPF warning. 20 minutes in 4th gear at 2500rpm was all that was required.

If you don't voluntarily go for a DPF cleaning drive then just heed the warning when it is displayed and drive as above to clear it out.

My driving is mainly short urban drives with a 50 mile motorway excusrion maybe every 4-6 weeks and I have no problems, bar the one instance I've mentioned.

Edit: Whoops, didn't answer the question - Yes the Vitara is DPF equipped.
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Post by Spruce on Mon Jan 18, 2016 11:59 pm

Thanks Forestdweller, very informative. I've never owned a Diesel before and there are probably other silly little things like this that I'll worry over or be misinformed about. Sounds pretty much like common-sense ownership, but agree that people are poorly informed. If I hadn't researched maybe that warning light would've been my first sign.

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Post by JOHNWALES on Wed Jan 27, 2016 9:53 am

I understand that this is quite important. Ignoring the warning light can lead to expensive repairs. If you continually do very short journeys, it is perhaps a good idea to occasionally race the engine in 2 nd or 3 rd. gear in order to clear it out. It needs to be remembered that 2000 r.p.m. in top gear is equivalent to 74 m.p.h. approx.

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Post by theforestdweller on Wed Jan 27, 2016 4:56 pm

I don't think "racing" the engine in 2nd or 3rd is necessary or will do the job. I certainly don't want to be driving in these gears for 20 minutes. 4th or 5th gear where the car is comfortable and above 2000rpm and keeping up with the rest of the traffic is my preference. That will give you 60-70mph without stressing anything Smile.
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Post by JOHNWALES on Wed Feb 03, 2016 10:12 pm

Sods law isn't it. I bought my Vitara a few weeks back with 2700 demonstrator miles on it. Drove it 160 miles home, since which time I have done three day trips in excess of 100 miles. I have got to admit I do like to get in 6 th as early as I can and I rarely get the engine above 2000 revs, after all that is 74 m.p.h. in 6th gear. Well tonight I was racing along south of Aberystwyth at 45 m.p.h. in 6 th. and the D P F light came on.; so I dropped down a few gears and drove at 3000 to 4000 revs for about 6 or 7 miles and then the light went off. Perhaps the filter had got clogged up whilst being driven by prospective buyers. So I do think it is necessary to work the engine quite frequently.

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Post by Guest on Sun Feb 07, 2016 3:15 pm

Hi all

I picked my SZ5 1.6 ddis wednesday i read the manual and it stated it has a DPF 20 mins above 2k i do 36 mile round trip to work so hope to recharge it regular.

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Post by JOHNWALES on Sun Feb 07, 2016 6:35 pm

On rural roads this will mean we need to drive for 20 minutes in a lower gear. I was rather surprised that my warning activated, because in the three weeks I have owned the car I had done a few motorway journeys, but probably only churned up to 1800 revs which is about 65 m.p.h.

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Post by Dorset-tx on Sun Apr 16, 2017 6:08 pm

I drive a mix of rural Dorset roads. Here we have no motorways, very few sections of fast dual or single carriage way, lots of hills and narrow winding roads. As yet I haven't had a DPF warning light come on.

My experience suggests that if the vehicle isn't travelling fast enough for long enough for it to do a passive regeneration it will do an active regeneration at approximately 200 miles intervals. This seem to be quite a short cycle, experimentation suggest that so long as the revs are between 1500-2000 it will complete in around 5-8 miles. Keeping the revs above 2000 doesn't seem to speed things up. It is difficult to be specific as it is difficult to detect exactly when the regen cycle starts.

The most obvious indication of an active regen is the burning smell, which only becomes apparent when you get out of the car. However, the other indications are:
The throttle response becomes a bit erratic.
Exhaust note is slightly noiser.
Auto stop is disabled.
Idle revs sit higher than normal.

Now if I spot this when I arrive somewhere, if time permits I tend to go for a drive until the cycle completes. This prevents incomplete cycles, avoids the nasty smell and hopefully means things aren't getting fried due to lack of cooling flow of air.

It would be great if there was a dash indicator for active regen.

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Post by Goudrons on Sun Apr 16, 2017 11:18 pm

DPF's have got a bad name, they've been getting better, but can still be very problematic and costly even if it's allowed to regenerate properly.

The idea is to trap the soot diesel engines produce.
Once this trapped soot builds up, the engine will inject extra fuel to burn the soot off in the filter, otherwise it'll just clog it up.

A problem arises when the engine can't complete it regen cycle.
The extra fuel finds it's way past the piston rings, into the sump and dilutes the engine oil.
The first owners used to know about this is when they checked their oil level and you can probably guess, many don't bother!

A diesel engine is prone to running on anything oily and it's not unheard of for a diesel to run away on it's own engine oil and until it goes bang, there's nothing you can really do to stop it.

Though many are now fitted with oil warning systems to try and notify owners there's a problem with oil dilution/high levels.

Another issue is once the soot has been burnt, it turns to ash.
Although the ash is finer in density than the soot it once was, it can't be burnt further or dealt with any other way, so it's just stored in the filter.

Most of the time the filters can be cleaned with a special Ceramex process (£250-£300), though dealers like to replace them instead as it makes them more money.

It's thought around 80,000 miles is about the average time it takes for one to fill up with ash, but that's not the whole story.

Short, cold engine trips cause the engine to generate a lot more soot than it would with a fully warm engine on a lengthy trip, so repeat these short trips too often and it causes the filter to regenerate more often.

Even if it's allowed to regenerate properly, the filter will fill with soot a lot quicker thus filling it with ash a lot sooner (and causing dealers to sell a lot more filters and blame the owners for buying the wrong car).

And as we know, if it's not allowed to regenerate properly, you end up with oil dilution.

You really need to think hard and long if a diesel is the right vehicle these days, particularly as hybrid's are now returning similar mpg for less headache.
Toyota's Hybrids are clocking up mega mileages with little fuss.

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Post by Gar Green on Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:39 am

Goudrons wrote:DPF's have got a bad name, they've been getting better, but can still be very problematic and costly even if it's allowed to regenerate properly.

The idea is to trap the soot diesel engines produce.
Once this trapped soot builds up, the engine will inject extra fuel to burn the soot off in the filter, otherwise it'll just clog it up.

A problem arises when the engine can't complete it regen cycle.
The extra fuel finds it's way past the piston rings, into the sump and dilutes the engine oil.
The first owners used to know about this is when they checked their oil level and you can probably guess, many don't bother!

A diesel engine is prone to running on anything oily and it's not unheard of for a diesel to run away on it's own engine oil and until it goes bang, there's nothing you can really do to stop it.

Though many are now fitted with oil warning systems to try and notify owners there's a problem with oil dilution/high levels.

Another issue is once the soot has been burnt, it turns to ash.
Although the ash is finer in density than the soot it once was, it can't be burnt further or dealt with any other way, so it's just stored in the filter.

Most of the time the filters can be cleaned with a special Ceramex process (£250-£300), though dealers like to replace them instead as it makes them more money.

It's thought around 80,000 miles is about the average time it takes for one to fill up with ash, but that's not the whole story.

Short, cold engine trips cause the engine to generate a lot more soot than it would with a fully warm engine on a lengthy trip, so repeat these short trips too often and it causes the filter to regenerate more often.

Even if it's allowed to regenerate properly, the filter will fill with soot a lot quicker thus filling it with ash a lot sooner (and causing dealers to sell a lot more filters and blame the owners for buying the wrong car).

And as we know, if it's not allowed to regenerate properly, you end up with oil dilution.

You really need to think hard and long if a diesel is the right vehicle these days, particularly as hybrid's are now returning similar mpg for less headache.
Toyota's Hybrids are clocking up mega mileages with little fuss.

Take this mans advice!
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Post by Jester on Sat Apr 22, 2017 11:44 pm

Apart from a brief flirtation with a Kia Soul I would and never have a diesel again.

I owned a Peugeot 407sw for 7 years of misery. Modern diesels are loaded up with too many emissions control systems to be the reliable workhorses they used to be.

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Post by JOHNWALES on Sun Apr 23, 2017 4:09 pm

Dread to think what my diesel Vitara will be worth when I come to sell !!!

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Post by Jester on Sun Apr 23, 2017 6:41 pm

The writing is definitely on the wall. Already hearing tales of second hand (sales not asking) prices dropping for diesels. Pretty much everyone I know who has a 5 year old diesel of any marque has DPF/Regen issues.

The next diesel I own will probably be probably a Yanmar. Smile


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Post by JOHNWALES on Mon Apr 24, 2017 9:50 pm

Petrol engines are becoming increasingly more economic. In continental Europe diesel is around 20 pence per litre cheaper than petrol, and I do wonder how long this situation will remain.

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Post by Admin on Tue Apr 25, 2017 7:41 am

In Europe they also have the LPG option at the pumps, if Diesel was as expensive there as the UK i feel Diesel would be even less popular

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Post by Jester on Tue Apr 25, 2017 9:47 pm

Hardly a day goes by without an anti diesel news piece of some sort being on the mainstream tv. Drip feeding into the unconsciousness of the public.

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Post by Gar Green on Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:16 am

Jester wrote:Hardly a day goes by without an anti diesel news piece of some sort being on the mainstream tv. Drip feeding into the unconsciousness of the public.  

Known as a "hypodermic syringe model"

That's my degree paying off for once.
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